Re: MONETARY: Outcompeting the current system

["Dan Parker" <dan.parker@globaljusticemovement.org>]

Good points Pablo, Hugh, Norm etc. I am also trying a small
local currency experiment in Whitecourt. I don't have
enough time yet to give it the attention it deserves,
but the jist of it is at

http://www.whitecourtweb.com/whitecourt_dollars.htm

Just third way concepts, as per the following link address
the danger of both government and private excessively
concentrated power.

http://www.globaljusticemovement.org/thirdway.htm

Regards
Dan Parker

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "hugh barnard" <hughbarnardlists@yahoo.co.uk>
To: <monetaryreform@cog.kent.edu>
Sent: Thursday, March 02, 2006 8:36 AM
Subject: MONETARY: Outcompeting the current system


> Without deciding on the mechanism or medium, I also am
> in favour of 'just doing something better' rather than
> starting a confrontation (that the 'reformers' are
> almost sure to lose). When enough people do that, (say
> 10 - 15%) there's a tipping point.
>
> For example, a little thought experiment, suppose
> there's a massive pick up of LETS or other mutual
> credit system but using anonymised and strongly
> encrypted exchanges. That's actually fairly difficult
> to control without shutting down the internet.
>
> In the meanwhile, I starve the current wasteful and
> corrupt system, simply by underearning (I have a
> work/life balance that emphasises the 'life' part)!
>
> Best regards Hugh Barnard
>
> http://hughbarnard.org
>
>
> --- Jock Coats
> <jock.coats@oxfordshirecommunitylandtrusts.org.uk>
> wrote:
>
>> I kind of agree Pablo, but why do you need another
>> mechanism/species
>> (gold).
>>
>> It has the same practical problems now as it did 300
>> years ago when
>> the shysters in the London and Amsterdam coffee
>> shops were trading it
>> for bits of paper.
>>
>> I agree the prospect of changing a government's way
>> of doing things
>> is a tall order, though I would, as you say, be
>> overjoyed if we were
>> to succeed.  But what about local responses - hijack
>> the usurers'
>> very own methods simply to create credit in the form
>> of local
>> currency with the backing of the common wealth.
>>
>> Yes, there are then still issues of a common
>> "carrier" currency, and
>> perhaps gold, or species backed money of some kind
>> can be that common
>> currency (though the very inflexibility of supply
>> poses issues on a
>> global scale in my opinion).
>>
>> Jock
>>
>> On 2 Mar 2006, at 13:36, pablo444@gmx.net wrote:
>>
>> > Hello Dan and Mr Frazee -
>> >
>> > Certainly, having met with both Rodney and Peter
>> on several
>> > occassions at the London Round Table meetings, I
>> can vouch for their
>> > total familiarity with the corrosive nature of the
>> incumbent money
>> > system.
>> >
>> > The question of course is what action should be
>> taken?
>> >
>> > There is a camp that seeks to influence Govt (and
>> related
>> > institutions) to take control of the money supply
>> so that all money
>> > be issued debt free and without interest. One
>> could call it
>> > Lincolnism or perhaps Greenbackism. I am not of
>> that camp (though I
>> > would be overjoyed were they to succeed) based on
>> the reasoning that
>> > I am not aware of any incumbent power group
>> happily giving up the
>> > reigns of their power to another group, merely
>> because that other
>> > group had a "better" way of doing things.
>> >
>> > The predominant money system is a societal control
>> mechanism for
>> > ensuring that those at the top (as they themselves
>> view things)
>> > remain at the top. And Govts enjoy considerable
>> power in the current
>> > arrangement and have little incentive, as yet, to
>> give it up. They
>> > love to spend money on their latest pet socialist
>> projects (a never
>> > ending stream of those) and this privately issued,
>> publicly disguised
>> > money system suits that purpose very well.
>> >
>> > A way I tend to favour is to work towards
>> out-competing the current
>> > money system. And in this fun, capitalist
>> complying model, I see gold
>> > as a favoured ammunition.
>> >
>> > To put things into contentious and politically
>> incorrect language,
>> > the aim simply, is to launder Federal Reserve
>> Notes, Euros, GB Pounds
>> > etc into gold and then conduct an ever increasing
>> % of your daily
>> > transactions in gold. Laundering is the correct
>> term when one
>> > considers the true nature and qualities of a
>> Federal Reserve Note,
>> > primary amongst which are:
>> >
>> > 1. It loses value relentlessly and can do nothing
>> else under the
>> > "Let's print a Billion" ethos of the Fed.
>> >
>> > 2. It is issued as a debt, repayable by the Govt.
>> >
>> > 3. It is interest bearing in such a design that
>> its repayment is
>> > technically impossible, so giving the lie to point
>> 2.
>> >
>> > 4. It's acceptance in payment of taxes gives it
>> its coercive, force
>> > backed quality which degrades free exchange.
>> >
>> > 5. It has produced a group of users who, because
>> of its system
>> > design, are literally addicted to it and require
>> an ever increasing
>> > amount to feed their addiction.
>> >
>> > 6. By subtly setting all men against one another,
>> it gradually and
>> > inevitably destroys civilised behaviour and with
>> it civilisation.
>> >
>> > Federal Reserve Notes and drugs produce similar
>> effects and for that
>> > reason, "Laundering" them is in fact a moral,
>> social and spiritual
>> > imperative. Govts are already "addicts" and
>> therefore it is
>> > unrealistic to expect them to cure themselves or
>> to treat kindly
>> > anyone who may be manouvering to cut off their
>> supply.
>> >
>> > So, launder FRN's into gold and then use gold (or
>> any other precious
>> > metal) to effect transactions.
>> >
>> > Why gold?
>> >
>> > The primary reason is that no one, that is NO ONE,
>> can make more of
>> > it at the drop of a hat. Not even the people who
>> may head up and run
>> > the multiplicity of private gold currency systems
>> such as e-gold,
>> > pecunix, goldmoney, e-bullion etc etc.
>> >
>> > I am not gold bug. And in his book "The Lost
>> Science of Money",
>> > Stephen Zarelenga clearly shows the mistaken
>> thinking around gold as
>> > money. But his alternative, to trust Govt, is
>> naieve. Gold is the
>> > least worst option, of that there is no doubt.
>> >
>> > Here's to an Honest Money System (no matter what
>> form it may
>> > ultimately take).
>> >
>> > Regards
>> >
>> > Pablo
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On 2 Mar 2006 at 4:50, Dan Parker wrote:
>> >
>> >> Dear Mr. Frazee,
>> >>
>> >> Having communicated with Rodney Shakespeare, and
>> having
>> >> read the book he co-wrote with Peter Challen (who
>> heads
>> >> the Christian Council for Monetary Justice), I
>> can say that he,
>> >> along with many of us, are aware of the monetary
>> dynamics
>> >> you so poetically describe.
>> >>
>> >> The bigger question is how best to advance
>> monetary
>> >> reform. We are engaged in a variety of efforts. I
>> self-
>> >> publish a magazine, do the website for the
>> Alberta
>> >> Social Credit Party and also one for Global
>> Justice.
>> >> As well we have had city councils pass
>> resolutions calling
>> >> for the creation of interest-free money etc.
>> >>
>> >> I think it is important to try to bring a lot of
>> these ideas
>> >> together to create synergy, which is needed due
>> to the
>> >> resources of the opposition. We have put enough
>> resources
>> >> together to effectively educate.
>>
> === message truncated ===
>
>
>
>
>
>
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